Blender Node API, what do we want?

[B.Y.O.B.]

Nodes make things more complex but nodes seem to have emerged as a meme

Nodes visualize connections, relationships, cohesions (don't know which word describes it best...). They will make some things look more complex than they are, that's why it would be good to be able to switch back to the old GUI in those cases, but some materials can be easier built up and understood when represented as a node graph IMO.

[J the Ninja]

I think a node editor is a great idea. Nodes make things more complex but nodes seem to have emerged as a meme so I think we should switch to them because it makes things more consistent and comfortable for users. Looking at dougal's screen shot, on the left we see a clean compressed display of all the options, on the right we see a psudo flowchart which takes up a lot more space with nice lines connecting them.

I think there is a video which really captures this idea, something I am sure LordCrc will remember: http://www.theonion.com/video/breaking- ... ati,14204/

It is less clunky to work with than the vertical flowchart once you start having a whole mess of a textures and mix materials.

[jensverwiebe]

Here are some papers from yafaray:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1kZv ... -Kb4Q/edit

http://www.yafaray.org/development/docu ... #Materials

...to see where we already "cross".


Jens

[Carbonflux]

It is less clunky to work with than the vertical flowchart once you start having a whole mess of a textures and mix materials.

heh reading my post now it does seem kind of cynical, which came out wrong, I meant to be more humorous

Upon reflection I look forward to learning this, it does seem like in the end it will be easier to read complex textures inside of textures. Also the 2.6x implementation of luxblend textures requires one to switch back and forth between several panels.

It is possible to copy and paste selected nodes into other textures?

[matali]

A material node system like filterforge :
Making your node system compatible with it would be really powerfull for launch as it would :
- have a big library from the begining.
- The "filters" are saved in xml, so easy to parse.
- It already reached version 3, and is mostly used by texture artist in the gaming world. So it has a great experience too.
It would really simplify our workflow because until now, we have to export the different texture (normal map, color ...) from filterforge and import them in blender. The set up is time consuming and if we need a change, we can't see it in realtime.
Formats are not protected, i'm no lawer but nothing i think prevent you of making your node system compatible.

[J the Ninja]

A material node system with Hugh presets ans user base : filterforge.
Making your node system compatible with it would be really powerfull for launch as it would :
- have a big library from the begining.
- The "filters" are saved in xml, so easy to parse.
- It already reached version 3, and is mostly used by texture artist in the gaming world. So it has a great experience too.
It would really simplify our workflow because until now, we have to save the different texture (normal map, color ...) and import them in blender. The set up is time consuming and if we need a change, we can't see it in realtime.
Formats are not protected, i'm no lawer but nothing i think prevent you of making your node system compatible.

uhhhh...what?

[matali]

Sorry for the bad english.
I mean that it would be great if instead of reinvente the whell, and to allow compatibility/save time for many artist, the node system could directly take the xml file preset of the texture program FilterForge. At least be compatible with it and work in about the same way. Better than explaining all it can do, those who don't know it can visit their website : (search filterforge on google, don't know if it's authorized to put a link here).
It has tons of "node system already done" (what i call presets) to make seamless wood, stones... materials.
It's late here, i hope i'm clear when i don't sleep a lot i'm don't speak that well english

[SATtva]

I'm sorry, but the customizable node system must be implemented in Blender, its core has nothing to do with Lux per se. So if you do want FilterForge compatibility, you really should contact Blender developers, not us.

[matali]

Oh, ok then i misunderstood what you want from us. Being more an artist than a dev, i thought you want us to tell you, how we wish the node system in lux to be, to make our workflow as good and easy as possible.
With all respect, not that much people did answer, maybe i'm not the only one not understanding what you exactly want. Could you then explain ?
I've red the first posts in this thread, i thought i was answering good.

In the case my english was bad again :
I would like as input : color, gradiant with 3/4 colors, noises (perlin...)
as trasnform nodes : treshold, blend (takes 2 textures, opacity value and a blend method like normal, multiply, add...), hue/saturation/lightness, an elevetion gradient, and a distortion node.

elevation gradient

noise distortion

As ouput, I agree with what was said, take color map, volume map, material map (reflexion map, diffuse map, alpha map)and IOR value.

It would allow to make things like meshes with mixed materials, like a partly frozen lake or a church window or an old metal that doesn't reflect evenly, we could have all this in one NGON without modeling it for real (the hole in ice, or the wire between the glass pieces...).

Here an example of a simple node in FF

wood node

edit : I forgot the emit map for the material, to allow one mesh to emit just from some point/area.
But please make clear what is on your side and what is to be decided on blender's side. Even then, you know how hard it is to be heard from them, so i have not that much hope if you don't bring those ideas at the same time you give your requierments to the BF.

Thanks again for your great renderer

[Lord Crc]

A material node system like filterforge :
Making your node system compatible with it would be really powerfull for launch

While I can certainly see it would be great to be able to use Filterforge presets directly, I think it would be unfeasible as the texturing system in LuxRender would have to match Filterforge in features and implementation, and due to the way LuxRender works internally this may be very difficult or impossible. For example the noise functions would have to match those of Filterforge exactly, even small differences could lead to drastically different results.